4 gen F-bod alignment
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lowered alignment
I have a built ws6 with long tubes and put lowering springs on it and no one could get it on a rack to 4 wheel alignment it. i had 17 zr1's with 275/40/17's. moral of the story i went back to stock springs
I have a built ws6 with long tubes and put lowering springs on it and no one could get it on a rack to 4 wheel alignment it. i had 17 zr1's with 275/40/17's. moral of the story i went back to stock springs
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What's the "U" ??
My problem isn't getting it on a rack or even finding a shop the problem is there is not enough adjustment on the lower A arm to bring it in. I've seen the lower tube A arms from UMI but don't know if there is enough adjustment.
Any one else? Or know if the lower A arms would adjust in enough?
I want to keep the low look...I love it.
Any one else? Or know if the lower A arms would adjust in enough?
I want to keep the low look...I love it.
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Ryan .. we want pics ..still at a loss on the U there refering to
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381 Posts
^^^ Ryan - We want pics! ^^^
Seriously, I just got back from having my '98 Z aligned. I have Eibach Sportlines on the front (2" drop). We had to put 2X4s leading up to, and on part of, the ramps. Still barely cleared. Then he had to use a 4X4 on a floor jack under the K-member to get the front wheels off the alignment machine. There wasn't enough clearance to use the machines built in jacks. It took him over 2 hours of adjusting, but he finally got it done right. Good ride now! I would suggest find a private shop that does alighments. Hopefully they'll take their time and get it done for ya.
Good luck, Jim
Seriously, I just got back from having my '98 Z aligned. I have Eibach Sportlines on the front (2" drop). We had to put 2X4s leading up to, and on part of, the ramps. Still barely cleared. Then he had to use a 4X4 on a floor jack under the K-member to get the front wheels off the alignment machine. There wasn't enough clearance to use the machines built in jacks. It took him over 2 hours of adjusting, but he finally got it done right. Good ride now! I would suggest find a private shop that does alighments. Hopefully they'll take their time and get it done for ya.
Good luck, Jim
The rack part is not the problem, yes 2x4s can be used. I am told there is not enough camber adjustment for a true alignment. Most shops just adjust toe. I've been told this by several shops, they are frame and alignment shops too.
As far as the U I assume it is part of the K member.
Wart, not to question the shop you went too but was the caster/camber adjusted to specs? And do you have the sheet to prove that? Is it a stock front end?
What I do know is the geometry has been changed with lower springs and the lower A arm must be pulled in to compensate for the loss in spring hight. I am by no means an expert, just know some basics.
The reason the frame shop talks about this U is to widen and allow for additional adjustment.
I can tell the inside of my tire is starting to wear.
As far as the U I assume it is part of the K member.
Wart, not to question the shop you went too but was the caster/camber adjusted to specs? And do you have the sheet to prove that? Is it a stock front end?
What I do know is the geometry has been changed with lower springs and the lower A arm must be pulled in to compensate for the loss in spring hight. I am by no means an expert, just know some basics.
The reason the frame shop talks about this U is to widen and allow for additional adjustment.
I can tell the inside of my tire is starting to wear.
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Ryan, I understand what you're saying about most shops. That's exactly what the guy at the shop that did my work told me. And yes they adjusted camber, caster and toe and yes I do have the sheet which proves it is within specs. It's a stock front end except the sway bar bushings and springs.
Jim
Jim
Good point about the tires. The thing is even on my other Fbod they had a problem doing my alignment and since I was at a frame/alignment shop only they wanted to bend stuff to get it in specs and wanted an extra 150 to do it. I didn't since I was short on cash at the time and the tires (17") wore on the inside bad. And before I started over again I thought I would gather some info.
Wart, would it be too much to ask if you could call that shop and ask if 17" x 9.5 would make a difference and not allow camber to be in specs? Thanks in advance.
Wart, would it be too much to ask if you could call that shop and ask if 17" x 9.5 would make a difference and not allow camber to be in specs? Thanks in advance.
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Well ill help you in advance there .. Stck GM'r is an 8 incher add 1.5 inches of a more defined tire and your dealing with negative camber ... But damn it'd be great on an oval .. Ever thought of changing driving habbits to just a high banked oval to work ?
When his align shop says there isnt enough adjustment there right .. it'd be out by atleast .3 or .4 ..not to mention ride quality would be affected
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When his align shop says there isnt enough adjustment there right .. it'd be out by atleast .3 or .4 ..not to mention ride quality would be affected
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Camber
Camber is the angle of the wheel, in degrees, when viewed from the front of the vehicle. Positive camber is when the top of the wheel is leaning out from the center of the car. Negative camber is when the top of the wheel is leaning into the car. If the wheel leans too far from the center, uneven wear will occur. The camber angle is designed and adjusted per vehicle to keep the tires on the outside of a curve flat on the ground during a turn. If you have too much positive camber, your tires will wear on the outside. Too much negative camber will wear them on the inside. If there is too much of a difference between the camber settings on the front wheels, the vehicle will tend to pull sharply to one side.
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Camber is the angle of the wheel, in degrees, when viewed from the front of the vehicle. Positive camber is when the top of the wheel is leaning out from the center of the car. Negative camber is when the top of the wheel is leaning into the car. If the wheel leans too far from the center, uneven wear will occur. The camber angle is designed and adjusted per vehicle to keep the tires on the outside of a curve flat on the ground during a turn. If you have too much positive camber, your tires will wear on the outside. Too much negative camber will wear them on the inside. If there is too much of a difference between the camber settings on the front wheels, the vehicle will tend to pull sharply to one side.
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I agree for road racing it is ideal! If I tug the wheel in a turn on a hwy bank the car sticks! BUT I'm not racing and my goodyears are suffering.
I don't want to drive my daily right now since the weather is soooo nice. (FLA) This car loves cool weather. :thumbsup:
Too much negative camber. You can see it as you walk up to the car. I have no pulls and it is smooth on the hwy 70+.
Anyone know if those lower A arms have enough adjustment?:dontknow:
I don't want to drive my daily right now since the weather is soooo nice. (FLA) This car loves cool weather. :thumbsup:
Too much negative camber. You can see it as you walk up to the car. I have no pulls and it is smooth on the hwy 70+.
Anyone know if those lower A arms have enough adjustment?:dontknow:
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i just had mine alinged a little while ago, the only problems i had were: getting on the rack with 3" duals; getting the caster to adjust
we would move it, tighten, check, same as before, come to find out that the bushing wouldnt move, so when you took the prybar out it went right back to where it was, had to air hammer the A-arm to get the bushing to move
we would move it, tighten, check, same as before, come to find out that the bushing wouldnt move, so when you took the prybar out it went right back to where it was, had to air hammer the A-arm to get the bushing to move
I hear that. I had replaced my whole front susp, Ls1 brakes, sway bar, all control arms and tie rods, just to find out I need to buy the adjustable lower A arms. It seems they may just have enough to get the front within specs. Thing is they are a few bucks and planed to spend the $$ that I saved on gears.
Here is what I KNOW...
Your A arms will have enough adjustment if you're trying to go with 0 camber. The only way you'll run out of adjustment is if you're trying to go negative camber, and you can still dial in A LOT of negative camber on the stock pieces. I've had LG G2 Super Springs, Eibach Pro Kit Springs, HAL QA1 Springs, and now Stock Springs with Koni Yellows on the lower perch, and I've had it aligned every single time with every single setup. If some place or somebody is telling you that garbage then either punch them in the mouth or walk out the front door and never take your car there again.
With caster and camber it's give and take, so decide what you want the most. The typical comfort/handling alignment for F-Bodies is as follows...
CASTER: 4 degrees POSITIVE (+)
CAMBER: 0.5-1.0 degrees NEGATIVE (-)
TOE: 0"
You can add in up to around 1.3-1.5, and some people have even been able to go as high as 1.8 degrees negative camber on the stock setup, but the most I've ever had was 1.3 degrees. I also wont give up any caster either so they can only get so much camber out of my setup (positive caster maintains high speed stability but requires a little more steering effort and widens your turning radius some). You can also add toe in or out but it's unnecessary IMO. Toe in will make your car track a little less and toe out will increase your initial turn in response but will also make your car track considerably more. IMO and many others, 4+ Caster and 0 Toe is ideal for these cars. Choose your camber based on your needs. Max tire wear with little concern for handling, put the camber at 0-0.5 NEGATIVE. Tire wear + traction compromise is 0.5-1.0 NEGATIVE camber. Max traction with disregard for tire wear have them put the caster at 4+ and then dial in as much camber as possible while keeping the sides within the same range (should be between 1.0-1.5 NEGATIVE camber).
Moral of the story: Chill out about your a-arms, they are fine.
Your A arms will have enough adjustment if you're trying to go with 0 camber. The only way you'll run out of adjustment is if you're trying to go negative camber, and you can still dial in A LOT of negative camber on the stock pieces. I've had LG G2 Super Springs, Eibach Pro Kit Springs, HAL QA1 Springs, and now Stock Springs with Koni Yellows on the lower perch, and I've had it aligned every single time with every single setup. If some place or somebody is telling you that garbage then either punch them in the mouth or walk out the front door and never take your car there again.
With caster and camber it's give and take, so decide what you want the most. The typical comfort/handling alignment for F-Bodies is as follows...
CASTER: 4 degrees POSITIVE (+)
CAMBER: 0.5-1.0 degrees NEGATIVE (-)
TOE: 0"
You can add in up to around 1.3-1.5, and some people have even been able to go as high as 1.8 degrees negative camber on the stock setup, but the most I've ever had was 1.3 degrees. I also wont give up any caster either so they can only get so much camber out of my setup (positive caster maintains high speed stability but requires a little more steering effort and widens your turning radius some). You can also add toe in or out but it's unnecessary IMO. Toe in will make your car track a little less and toe out will increase your initial turn in response but will also make your car track considerably more. IMO and many others, 4+ Caster and 0 Toe is ideal for these cars. Choose your camber based on your needs. Max tire wear with little concern for handling, put the camber at 0-0.5 NEGATIVE. Tire wear + traction compromise is 0.5-1.0 NEGATIVE camber. Max traction with disregard for tire wear have them put the caster at 4+ and then dial in as much camber as possible while keeping the sides within the same range (should be between 1.0-1.5 NEGATIVE camber).
Moral of the story: Chill out about your a-arms, they are fine.
I was just trying to avoid the experience I've had in the past with my other Fbods. I'll be armed with some info now. I just hated to be told go to another shop (3) etc...and we need to bend...to get it in specs. I'm setting the appt for next week and will post the results.
Thanks Josh!
Thanks Josh!
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Ryan,
Sorry I've been silent. I was out of town until late last evening. I called the shop that did my alignment and he said different wheel sizes won't make a difference. Looks like Josh and the others are "steering" us in the right direction. :roflmao: Sorry, couldn't help myself!
Good luck Ryan.
Jim
Sorry I've been silent. I was out of town until late last evening. I called the shop that did my alignment and he said different wheel sizes won't make a difference. Looks like Josh and the others are "steering" us in the right direction. :roflmao: Sorry, couldn't help myself!
Good luck Ryan.
Jim
Good deal. I've found if you go in with your specs written out on paper, and when you're talking with them convey that the car is your baby and you want precision, they'll usually do a very good job. I didn't ask, but two different places have brought me into the garage area to show me all the specs on the screen before they pulled the car off the rack just to get my OK. Thats service if you ask me. :thumbsup: Take in a sheet of paper with your desired caster, camber, and toe settings and see what they can do for you.ryanws6 said:
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