What's the Stock rear end good for?

[BLACK KNIGHT]

I believe I have the stock 10 bolt rear with 3.23 gears. I was just wondering what the likely breaking point is? I'd like to eventually get up to about 400hp with the help of like a 75 shot of nitrous in the far future. Is the rear end going to hold up to this? Also would slicks have any effect as well? Like, I'd like to get a pair of 15" rims and some cheater slicks next summer...will that hurt the rear end? I'm just wondering how far I can go on the stock rear?

[Chris 96 WS6]

Slicks DEFINITELY make a difference. Shouldn't be too hard to understand why.

The good news is automatic cars are easier on the rear ends due to less shock involved on launch. There are many stock 10-bolt auto cars well into the 11s on ET Streets & Nittos. The 75 shoot will definitely cause a shock but if 1) if you don't hit it off the line it will help and 2) your total HP still isn't going to be in 10-bolt breaking territory.

At your power levels currently you've got nothing to worry about for a while. When you start getting up over 400hp to the wheels you need to start thinking about going to a 12-bolt.

[BLACK KNIGHT]

Good, then it sounds like I shouldn't have to worry about that too much. I can concentrate on go fast stuff then. :)

[LiquidFire350]

2) your total HP still isn't going to be in 10-bolt breaking territory.

At your power levels currently you've got nothing to worry about for a while. When you start getting up over 400hp to the wheels you need to start thinking about going to a 12-bolt.
i have heard of people breaking theirs at stock HP levels, a4 or m6 i do not recall

it varies from car to car, ive heard people break them stock and i know a guy that was running 11s with the stock rear

apperently ive bent somthing, either the housing or the carrier, and ive yet to break 12s

[Phoenix57]

i know a guy with a M6 cam and 150 shot runnin on a built 10 bolt. has a stud girdle stronger axles. hes runnin mid 11s. im hopin my rear holds out for awhile, but a 3200 stall, F13, and 100+ shot might have somehtin to say about that

[Firehawk 526]

I believe we have a local white T/A LS1 that is running a 100 dryshot on stock rear/stock manifolds, and running low 12's.

I say "borrowed time", and someone told me a while back (not sure who or when) that the stock rear should be capable of 400 rwhlhp w/o major issues, but you are still pressing your luck IMO, especially w/M6.

Not sure if it was BS, truth, or opinion! It all depends on tires, launching technique, etc. as to how long the OEM rear will hold out.

[LiquidFire350]

oh and the guy i was talking about had 4.11s, solid pinion spacer, cover gridle, 28" slickes

[Transamman25]

anyone in here running 4:11's ? my 6 speeder has one hell of a first gear .. good to 55 or so before i slap to second (a little high?).. seems to me like 4:11's would dramaticly step up performance

[CamTom12]

To answer the subject question literally...

paperweight?

[Chris 96 WS6]

anyone in here running 4:11's ? my 6 speeder has one hell of a first gear .. good to 55 or so before i slap to second (a little high?).. seems to me like 4:11's would dramaticly step up performance

Sure, just don't expect the stock rear to hold together at the track with those gears. Numerically bigger gears are weaker because there's more teeth crammed onto the same size ring gear, meaning the teeth have to be thinner and therefore weaker.

[LiquidFire350]

To answer the subject question literally...

paperweight?
you know when i first read the thread title before posting, thats what i thought of :roflmao:

[Frosty]

Horsepower doesn't break a 10-bolt. Horsepower with TRACTION kills that 10-bolt :roflmao:

[CamTom12]

you know when i first read the thread title before posting, thats what i thought of :roflmao:

Glad I'm not the only one, lol

[tbojbob]

To answer the subject question literally...

paperweight?


Yep, I imediately thought of "boat anchor"! :lol:

[gettinthere]

The rear ends on A4 car can put up with alot more abuse than on an M6 car.

That being said, you should be fine. If you are going to go with a slick though, don't go over a 26" tire. Then you will most likely break it.

[99formulam6]

anyone in here running 4:11's ? my 6 speeder has one hell of a first gear .. good to 55 or so before i slap to second (a little high?).. seems to me like 4:11's would dramaticly step up performance
well, i have stock gears in my Formula, and i shift @ 6300 and thats going 45mph...so 55mph is a little high...maybe you have 3.23's or 2.73s...?

[CamaroJake]

Read gettinthere's post about rear ends, should answer your Q's.

http://www.ls1lt1.com/forum/showthread.php?t=892

[remaxracer45]

i'm doing a gear change in my ws6 and am reading several posts that lower number gears are the way to go for strength, I have a built motor 400rwhp or so so I really don't need gear and have a 6 spped with a spec 4 clutch, i do have a stud girdle, what normally breaks on these?

[Chris 96 WS6]

Ring gear normally breaks...as in teeth shred off, usually due to the pinion gear walking up the ring gear....too much tq collapses the crush sleeve and the pinion gets out of whack. But axles will break and even the housing will snap. The Spec 4 clutch = certain death to the rear end IMO...too much grab and no slip means all that shock is going straight to the gears.

[LiquidFire350]

too much tq collapses the crush sleeve and the pinion gets out of whack.
so your saying a solid spacer would be the way to go

when i changed mine, i didnt know how that would work with the shims so i went with the crush sleeve

[Jaberwaki]

I know its around here somewhere........

http://ls1lt1.com/forum/showthread.php?t=892

aaaahhhhh there it is ;)

[gettinthere]

I know its around here somewhere........

http://ls1lt1.com/forum/showthread.php?t=892

aaaahhhhh there it is ;)


Only about a week too late. :lol:

http://ls1lt1.com/forum/showpost.php?p=23216&postcount=17

[Jaberwaki]

oh HELL no!

[Jaberwaki]

Read gettinthere's post about rear ends, should answer your Q's.

http://www.ls1lt1.com/forum/showthread.php?t=892


That there is JABER'S post boss man

[NBM2001z28]

Stock 10 bolts are good to keep the car rolling around until you buy your 12 bolt or 9". Other then that, they're not good for anything :)

[CamTom12]

Ring gear normally breaks...as in teeth shred off, usually due to the pinion gear walking up the ring gear....too much tq collapses the crush sleeve and the pinion gets out of whack. But axles will break and even the housing will snap. The Spec 4 clutch = certain death to the rear end IMO...too much grab and no slip means all that shock is going straight to the gears.

I agree if you're talking about sticky tires.

With regular streets, it doesn't matter what clutch you run as to how long your rear will last. You're just going to break the tires loose before you can do any real damage anyway

[Enthusiast]

Well I always hear about people breaking 10bolts with stock power on street tires, but from personal experience Ive seen two very high horsepower cars running through the stock 10bolt and neither have failed (yet). Granted they are used more fro AutoX and Road Racing they do see some pretty hard launches on the street.
The slower one of the two is an LS1 and its making roughly 475 rwhp and hes got 315 BFG KDs out back and hes getting some 3.9 0-60 runs on my Gtech. Thats a pretty damn hard launch if you ask me.
Really just dont be stupid with it and more than likely you wont break it. I think if you break one its your own damn fault.
A 6K Clutch Side Step on Slicks is more than likely going to do it in. Just use a little common sense and if your gonna be at the track step up to a beefier rear.

[Firehawk 526]

Hi-stalls, and lauching M6's at 5-6K will most likely do it everytime.......sticky's or streets, it is just a matter of time! TORQUE

Read this interesting thread! Basically this.....There are various reasons why the 10 bolts fail, but most are due to the crush sleeve and the case flexing. Case flex can ruin bearings and cause problems with the crush collar. It can also assist the ring and pinion in stripping themselves of all their teeth by knocking the contract pattern out of whack. Getting a good solid case is the start. Next would be a crush collar eliminator and a rear TA cover. Welding the tubes helps strudy the case alittle. After that like fireball said you can reinforce it alittle with some steel stock but you are just about as far ahead to have a holy man bless it at that moment as well because after welding the tubes, TA girdle, and a crush sleeve eliminator all installed you will probiably break something not associated with the case if you don't shear teeth off like the differential or in the worst case an axle.
http://www.fbodycentral.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=35311&highlight=rear

[TheSilverSurfer]

If you get a bad stup from the factory it won't last long at all. I have had my rear replaced twice and I don't race the car!

[mrr23]

both cars still have stock 10 bolts in them with the exception of 3.73 gears. wife's car was in the 481 rwhp range on a 150 shot and 3200 stall. my black one is 459 rwhp right now.

[99formulam6]

its basically hit or miss. some people are lucky and have tons of power on the stock rear, and some people cant make it last with stock power